Jason Bowers
Jason’s connection to Jamaica through his grandfather is not immediately apparent to most people who know him but he is proud of his blended heritage that also reflects other European nations such as Germany and Ireland. He feels that he has a privileged position of being more attuned to difference because of his cultural background. Recent conversations have led him to a new age of curiosity into his own past which was previously unexplored. He also talks about the new opportunities Hull has as the UK City of Culture and how that will bring positive change and development that he hopes people will embrace.
|
To go to the written transcription click on the box below
Transcription: Jason Bowers Interview
Interview with Jason Bowers
Interviewer: Jerome Whittingham
Date: 10 January 2017
JW So - just for the benefit of the listener then, can you introduce yourself to the people that are listening?
JB: I’m Jason Bowers, I was born 1971, in the summertime of 1971, brought up on Grapefield Estate in East Hull and currently teaching privately and I’ve come here today.
JW: So – I’m intrigued as to your connection to Africa. What makes you a contemporary African Voice?
JB: Way back on my father’s side, my grandfather was from Jamaica – he was born late 1800s and that is the connection.
Obviously he married my grandma in around 1930 in Hull.
JW: So tell me the sort of connections then between Hull and your grandfather back then.
JB: My grandfather – his father was a chemist from what I understand and my grandfather joined the merchant navy and there were something there to do with the World War and he came to England in about 1920 I think so that is the connection there. And then from that, they were married and then my grandma had twins, which was Aubrey and Jennifer – and they again grew up in East Hull so there is a connection there, East Hull and my grandfather who was from Beckford Kraal in Jamaica.
JW: Have you ever visited?
JB: I have visited Jamaica, yes, I’ve visited quite a few islands in the West Indies. Some for the cricket because we do like cricket in our family and then at one point I did go to Jamaica with my father to try and find out some bit sort of heritage or a little bit more and that was when I was 25.
JW: Let’s dig further into that then now into what you found out when you were there.
JB: What I found out was that we experienced the island to start with, so I could personally get a feel for Jamaica and from there we hired a taxi for the day. My dad had done some research already so Beckford Kraal was the area we were going to but little did I know that Beckford Kraal was about two hours up a mountain in a van that we’d hired for the day, which was not the best van, with a taxi driver that took us through the potholes and the humidity up to some scary heights where - some of the locals hadn’t seen white people before and it was quite an experience even though I’d travelled quite extensively up to that age – it was still, it was a different experience. The research or the finding that we got – having spoken to locals – they were, were a few people there that recognised the name Bowers but we didn’t get as much information as we would have liked to come back with. But having said that - it was a big passion of my father’s to find out more information – and then gradually as you get older, you start to realise or you find that you should have paid more attention when you were younger.
JW: So did you find anything out about the family’s employment or business history?
JB: The history side of things or the employment as I say was my great grandfather, that would be James Bowers was a chemist – outside of that, I don’t really know.
JW: So size of the family, are there people out there that you’re keeping in touch with outside any family members?
JB: In Jamaica, no, but with all the Caribbean Islands being quite close together there are a number of Bowers surnames in different, we have found Bowers in Antigua, whether they are actually related, we are not really sure. With a little bit more information or contacts to go on, I’m sure out there there are, is a wider Bowers family but we haven’t as of this moment found a direct connection.
JW: Growing up then – as a very young child, - did any of this background to your family mean anything to you? Did it have any impact on you?
JB: Up to the age of 10 we were, we had knowledge right along, regarding – our family and on both sides of the family there’s so much diversity there on where people have come from. So in respect of knowing or feeling any different at that age, I wouldn’t say that I did. Until a point where I’d written an essay for school, I must have been 11 or 12 on – stereotypes and stereotypical situations. That was the point that my father started to explain some of the situations that he’d experienced as a child or experiences that his father had been through or my father had seen so, my granddad actually, I never met my granddad because he died when my father was a lot younger, when my dad was about 13 so all of this is just stories but there’s a certain age that things start to make sense and that was about, around about 11 or 12 whereby I got more of an understanding about the outside world and also our history or background to where we actually originated from.
JW: How important do you think that is to an understanding of your identity?
JB: I don’t think it affected me at a young age but when you get to the age of about 12 when you’ve got more understanding of about life then you can, you can then start appreciating other people’s point of view or shall we say empathy. So then you’ve got a much better understanding coming through junior school which I was of the age where I went to junior school and you realise that everybody does have different backgrounds and you can start to see how other people interact, other people’s way of life and especially because coming from a council estate where most of this council estates is new so all these people brought together. These council estates were built in the 1960’s so anybody moving onto these estates are all of a similar mindset or are, they’re coming at it from the same angle so by the time you’re in the 1970’s and you’ve got all these children that are growing up on these estates, nobody had any money, everybody seem to pull together.
There was a good community spirit and then from that you can see how life plays out and you can see because I went to Andrew Marvell Secondary School – we had a couple of Black pupils there. Obviously I could relate and understand and see in a different context to some of the other people or people in the same classes that had different views or had different backgrounds or weren’t aware of their backgrounds which does affect you as a child massively. It’s more having an understanding and being able to see things from other people’s point of view.
JW: Yeah, has it sparked any interest in any sort of cultural influences? Have you absorbed any cultural or West Indian influences?
JB: Yes, because when, that was actually the first time I went to the West Indies, the way of life, their attitude to life, the food, the family values which seem to be very strong and continued way past when you were a teenager I really do like. You can get to a point when that is, that is seen as something a little bit different to where most people go. So to have that understanding and then to get that hook of liking the Caribbean because after my first visit I must have been there 4 times now, to different islands.
And I do love the way of life and the way they have, work isn’t everything let me say. Work isn’t everything and coming from a family like I do that is quite creative and my father used to play the piano and my mum used to run a dance class so we always come up with this creativity and some of the carnivals that I’ve been to or Shirley Heights on a Sunday night or some of the beaches, just, just some of the things that are coming back to me now as I’m speaking. And even down to Shaky’s Pizza in Jamaica which is in Octoreus if I can remember rightly that for someone off a council estate is quite an eye-opener the first time you go there and then since then I’ve been with friends on a number of occasions. It just opens their eyes as well. We still talk about the holidays we had in Barbados now when we went to watch the cricket and it’s this is 20, 20 years later and it’s still the holiday we talk about in the pub when we meet at Christmas or whatever – to just reminisce about all times because it was fantastic.
JW: That West Indian attitude towards life. Have you absorbed that or was it innate within you? Are you a laid back sort of fella?
JB: No, to be quite honest, no. My sister and my father so laid back, totally different attitude to me but that is just the person that you are isn’t it. I can, I can relax when you get me to one of those beaches or one of those bars or one of those events or musical event but no. I have a different, a totally different approach to things like that than my sister for example and it’s something I can’t really fall into.
JW: I’ve got in my mind what might be quite a stereotypical image of people from the West Indies but I think of them as being very,very creative and fun loving. Would that be an accurate description of that national character?
JB: I think it would to a certain degree – but people are always going to find creativity in whatever sense that is whether that is in an art form, whether it is music. It’s just more opportunities need to be taken to have events or cultural experiences or get-togethers shall we say so instead of having a meal let’s have a get together on the beach as a massive family and let’s all bring a little bit each – so they’re the sort of things that I can see or that stand out to me that are a little bit different and just the enjoyment of life really and the fun side of life which I suppose goes with the territory really as in whether that is the outdoor sort of life or having to deal with hurricanes that hit you – that’ another thing that comes back to me now, how it can go from brilliant sunshine to there’s a tornado coming down the road, let’s get in and get out of the way.
JW: So what sort of influence does this background have on you now? Are there any great icons of the West Indies that you look up to and have they influenced you?
JB: Not in my sense at the moment. It was more about the experiences that I actually had there. But having said that, Garfield Sobers, cricketer, was a big inspiration to my father, I know that, who did, and went to the cricket and managed to get him a shirt signed by him, so- but no it’s more about the lifestyle and the enjoyment for life and the live music and the experiencing things and being able to get involved rather than someone I can say ‘iconic’ or…no…no.
JW: Tell me something about any cultural changes you’ve noticed in Hull over the years that you’ve been living here.
JB: Cultural changes: two years ago we actually went to Liverpool to a go-see, once we knew that we were getting City of Culture; dealing with different schools or colleges throughout the East Riding – I have seen, and North Lincolnshire. I have seen a change to other people’s perceptions about what we are doing in Hull. Again friends that have come back that had moved away to go to university and stayed where they’ve stayed, have come back and said “that marina looks amazing now,” and “I can’t believe the difference in Hull.” And to live here you don’t see it as much, until someone points it out. But then once they do, and you think: that Marina is starting to look better, and this may be four or five years ago. So from that point you start to think, yes we are gradually getting there.
My, or what I have seen of other people’s views on Hull and the City of Culture in the last two years, have changed phenomenally in the fact that people are more aware; they are a little bit more perceptive because Hull as a, Hull as a community or a breed, are a little bit - well we’ll wait and see what everybody else thinks first. So, there is a big change, and it has had to build up slowly, not in order to not frighten people, but the things I’ve seen in the last year and some of the meetings I’ve had and the discussions with the different areas and the different groups, and then some of them I think I’ve seen over the last two weeks; I’m talking to people that I really didn’t think would get involved with City of Culture. - It’s changed my mind, give me - much more confidence that the, the City of Culture will get to the people that, of Hull, that need to be able to see and experience and then be enlightened, gradually, by some of these events that I’ve seen in Liverpool and different places, delivered in a professional manner because that was my concern. And I think, as it is now, this is just the start to the City of Culture.
JW: Would you describe Hull as a culturally diverse city?
JB: Yes I would.
JW: You would?
JB: I would in the fact that, - looking back and - diversity comes from people bringing new knowledge from different areas, different parts of the world, and just looking at The Deep and the arrivals and departures and all of it, just brings back in one fell swoop just how diverse Hull is. And for the, was it 300,000 visitors, that was just there for people to see and understand - with very little words, in a visual format, just in the last 150 - 200 years how we have been not only a port but this diverse area that people have come to, or on their way to somewhere else, or they get here and they don’t go anywhere else, or even getting through to Liverpool and the port there. And so yes, I think it is very cultural or could be even more so in the future once we have a little bit more confidence in ourselves and that is the people of Hull and how we can portray ourselves to the outside world.
JW: Do you think it’s significant, or is there any significance in the fact that, say for the sort of last three decades - you know: we benefited from globalisation; trade across the globe has been easier; communication across the globe has been easier, then all of a sudden there seems to be sort of racial boundaries and cultural boundaries remerging - do you think that’s true? Is that evident in Hull?
JB: The world is getting smaller due to the internet and everything else. But immigration or, immigration is nothing new. How people react to it and the publicity it gets, how it’s sold in the media I think has changed. But immigration has always been there. And, this employing and distributing labour throughout the world has always gone on. And travel has got faster, communication has gone faster as you say, but how it is sold and the negativity that it picks up from people that think they wound benefit from giving that side of the story. People’s awareness and understanding, it’s knowledge isn’t it? It’s just coming back to the empathy again, and the understanding of people because when I look back at my grandparents on both sides of the family, then it’s evident that at some point that people either want to explore or have to travel to different places or, for all sorts of different reasons and I can see that.
Teaching, whether it be teaching in Scarborough, I’ve thought about this ten years ago, I was teaching in Scarborough but I was teaching a boy there who was Polish, and he was with his mother and then a year later, his father had come and he had started to do a course as well. So I can see connections there in how their family are either travelling to better themselves or for whatever reason. Everybody has different reasons, but to be able to understand or allow, or give them time to develop and pursue whatever, whatever it is and whatever reason that these people need time don’t they.
JW: You’re a very skilled designer and but you concentrate on teaching and inspiring young people too. Why have you taken that route?
JB: I took that route after - working for myself and also teaching part time. And it, there comes a point where the only way we really evolve is through sharing knowledge and once you realise that, if as a designer you can work with one client and that means one person benefits from either the knowledge or the expertise that you’ve got. You work with a class or a group, then all them people are sharing that information - all them people will go off into different avenues and use that information in different ways. But also, I get to learn as much as some of the pupils because it is a fast moving world, as we’ve said technology and everything, it is hard to keep up, especially as a teacher, with the marking and the preparation and everything else. So, it offers me the freedom to be able to not only communicate and share knowledge and ideas, but also learn from the pupils that I teach. So it is a two way process and that then becomes much more exciting, much more engaging, because when I look back, some of the teachers that I had at junior school that still influence me now. But it’s not until you think back and look at some of these situations and think, well there’s no reason why I can’t sort of go into that avenue and do it, not only for myself, and privately, but that gives me the flexibility to be able to deal with the pupils or students that would benefit most.
JW: Looking to the future - what are your hopes and dreams both for yourself and for the city of Hull.
JB: For myself, to with start with, for the future. Now, I always said, and this links back directly to why we are here today, that I would be quite happy to have a little strip of beach in Barbados and rent out half a dozen deck chairs so that I could experience all these things that I like about the Caribbean, but also to be able to share stories and information and just generally talk to people in a relaxed atmosphere and possibly get some of this laid back attitude that some of the other members of my family have. But as you grow up, you realise, that there’s other things that you’d like to pursue, not to say that I wouldn’t like to do that when I retire, but - for the future, to be able to narrow things down and get the teaching side together. I would like in ten years time to have a canal boat that could be used as a teaching pod which would then allow us to have a floating design studio, think back to all this travel and experience and the exciting side of life that I like, and that would enable me to do everything with the freedom and flexibility of what I’ve spent two years setting up now.
For the city of Hull and the City of Culture: had a conversation this morning with someone -who told me “that’ll all be done and finished by August.” I laughed, started explaining the Liverpool story, because I can only see it being the start of something on a much bigger scale that outside investors will want to get involved in, people will want to come to Hull, people will want to live in Hull. And from that, it will hopefully spark the, it will spark the people of Hull to go out and explore some of these areas that we seem to be a little bit frightened of at the moment because - the debate about The Blade now, is it art, is it now art, is it just engineering - I don’t think it really matters what people think it is, it is caused such debate - and viewpoints - which even in my house we can’t agree on it. So I think over the next five, seven years we will see even further development and promotion of the city and what we can achieve long term.
JW: So Jason I’ve known you quite a while, and I didn’t know that you had an African connection. It’s quite a surprise there.
JB: There is a surprise to a lot of people that I know. Yeah a lot of my friends - up to the age of, say 20, didn’t know that I had African roots. The ones that do know are still quite surprised. Some still don’t believe me. They’ll probably believe me now. But, having said that, there’s no reason they should know, unless we get to a conversation, where it comes up, where it comes up in conversation because as you can tell, it’s not a conversation you can take in two minutes. Someone ask me that, there’s a lot of questions that going to follow it, which then means we’re sat there, maybe an hour, we may be explaining things. And also the fact that I didn’t until the last few weeks, have great understanding what that heritage was, other than knowing that my Granddad was from Jamaica, he married my Grandma when he came to Hull about the 1930s.
Outside of that, I didn’t really know much more other than the fact that looking back now, that obviously was quite taboo at the time. Also the fact that they had twins and my dad was a lot lighter in colour with blue eyes than his sister. Now there’s another thing, that when he looked back, I would like to ask questions of, say my grandparent’s as to what they experienced, or how that, how that was. But in my own sense, there’s, I’ve been open with people, but It is hard to look at me, and think other than the fact that I’ve got the traditional curly hair from the Bowers family, again, that’s not as curly as my sister’s.
JW: Is it becoming increasingly important to you that people know of your heritage?
JB: I think there will be a lot more questions, now - and I’m quite happy to answer these questions, but it’s not really the sort of thing that usually comes up in conversation unless they are close friends, or because, why would somebody come up to you, and ask. But having said that, once people do, they are quite intrigued, in the fact that one side of, one side of the family I’ve got a granddad that’s from Jamaica, and I’ve got a grandma that’s from Hull, but yet on the other side of the family I’ve got a grandma whose parents were from Ireland and a granddad whose father was German who also came over in the war. So for someone to start asking me about my heritage, or, there’s all sorts there, that it’s not a two minute conversation. But also goes back to what we’ve said already about the diversity and, the = area of Hull and how it has this diverse culture and people obviously seem to have come here for, just my… In our generation as in all generations, there are so many people that if they hadn’t have come to Hull for whatever reason, means I wouldn’t be here today.
JW: Is it something you take more pride in as the years go by?
JB: Yes.
JW: Yes. Why?
JB: Because it makes me feel, it makes me feel that, not only am I a little bit different in the sense that I have got, like a lot of people, with mixed or, immigration or mixed cultures from different parts of the world, these things come together for some special reason that is outside of my control, won’t be repeated again and It’s the sort of things that money can’t buy. Until you start getting a little bit older, you start looking at these things and just weighing up just how much of life is really outside of your hands - when you like to think that you’re good on the planning side of things like myself, it is, yes , and I do feel quite proud and privileged to have parents from all different parts of the world.
JW: Are there any circumstances in which you would feel uncomfortable sharing this information?
JB: Not at all. Why, no, not at all, and why should I? Its, it’s part of me - there’s things there that = have obviously influenced the way I’ve been brought up in the past. There’s the fact that I was brought up on a council estate, so I, I’ve been christened at the local church, I’ve been to the primary school, and alongside of all that, that’s the side that people see, there’s all this diverse background that makes everyone in life who they are today.
JW: Are the West Indian influences in your, in your background, of more importance, of more importance than the German or Irish?
JB: - No. No, because when I look at it like that, these people I didn’t know, and it’s all information that I am told. I get much more understanding of possibly my heritage by visiting these places, so, although I like going to Jamaica or Antigua or Barbados, but in the same respect I can get a much better understanding of, maybe how my great grandparents were by, going to Germany and being in Berlin, and again, loving the fact of Berlin and the way that is, a totally different place to Jamaica, but again I feel quite comfortable in the cultural diversity and mixing , and the excitement, all the things that possibly my grandparents experienced, and that’s why they travelled or explored way back a hundred years ago. Do I think people’s perception of me will change? – Personally I’m not really bothered if it does or not. I think there’ll be a lot more questions. People will want to know more, about my background, or my grandparents’ back ground, on the either side from what we’ve just discussed. But - it also opens up a lot of opportunities for me to find out more about grandparents way back, and also, new questions that will be either asked of me, or I can ask of other people, because this has started, possibly , a whole new different avenue to how people will perceive me, expect me to act, or I don’t know, it might just, I really don’t know. It’s quite exciting though.
JW: If there’s one point you‘d want the listener to take away from what you’ve shared in the last half an hour, what would that be, what would your message be?
JB: - To book one extra day to however long you are coming to visit Hull, and when you think you’ve done everything that is on your list, or anybody else has told you to do, get on one of the local buses and out into some of the - council estates or, areas that people are developing, doing their own projects, doing exhibitions and promoting their side of Hull, and what Hull means to them. Not just the town centre and the history there, but some of these estates that have got their own communities and - don’t always get into the town centre, or the children don’t always get into the town centre, yet they’re doing their own exhibitions, projects relating to their side of Hull, how they see Hull, and how they’d like to promote it to the wider audience. And that would be, that would be the thing that I’d advise people to do. Get out and go see the further reaches of Hull and the surrounding areas.
JW: Jason, thank you very much
JB: Thank you.
Interviewer: Jerome Whittingham
Date: 10 January 2017
JW So - just for the benefit of the listener then, can you introduce yourself to the people that are listening?
JB: I’m Jason Bowers, I was born 1971, in the summertime of 1971, brought up on Grapefield Estate in East Hull and currently teaching privately and I’ve come here today.
JW: So – I’m intrigued as to your connection to Africa. What makes you a contemporary African Voice?
JB: Way back on my father’s side, my grandfather was from Jamaica – he was born late 1800s and that is the connection.
Obviously he married my grandma in around 1930 in Hull.
JW: So tell me the sort of connections then between Hull and your grandfather back then.
JB: My grandfather – his father was a chemist from what I understand and my grandfather joined the merchant navy and there were something there to do with the World War and he came to England in about 1920 I think so that is the connection there. And then from that, they were married and then my grandma had twins, which was Aubrey and Jennifer – and they again grew up in East Hull so there is a connection there, East Hull and my grandfather who was from Beckford Kraal in Jamaica.
JW: Have you ever visited?
JB: I have visited Jamaica, yes, I’ve visited quite a few islands in the West Indies. Some for the cricket because we do like cricket in our family and then at one point I did go to Jamaica with my father to try and find out some bit sort of heritage or a little bit more and that was when I was 25.
JW: Let’s dig further into that then now into what you found out when you were there.
JB: What I found out was that we experienced the island to start with, so I could personally get a feel for Jamaica and from there we hired a taxi for the day. My dad had done some research already so Beckford Kraal was the area we were going to but little did I know that Beckford Kraal was about two hours up a mountain in a van that we’d hired for the day, which was not the best van, with a taxi driver that took us through the potholes and the humidity up to some scary heights where - some of the locals hadn’t seen white people before and it was quite an experience even though I’d travelled quite extensively up to that age – it was still, it was a different experience. The research or the finding that we got – having spoken to locals – they were, were a few people there that recognised the name Bowers but we didn’t get as much information as we would have liked to come back with. But having said that - it was a big passion of my father’s to find out more information – and then gradually as you get older, you start to realise or you find that you should have paid more attention when you were younger.
JW: So did you find anything out about the family’s employment or business history?
JB: The history side of things or the employment as I say was my great grandfather, that would be James Bowers was a chemist – outside of that, I don’t really know.
JW: So size of the family, are there people out there that you’re keeping in touch with outside any family members?
JB: In Jamaica, no, but with all the Caribbean Islands being quite close together there are a number of Bowers surnames in different, we have found Bowers in Antigua, whether they are actually related, we are not really sure. With a little bit more information or contacts to go on, I’m sure out there there are, is a wider Bowers family but we haven’t as of this moment found a direct connection.
JW: Growing up then – as a very young child, - did any of this background to your family mean anything to you? Did it have any impact on you?
JB: Up to the age of 10 we were, we had knowledge right along, regarding – our family and on both sides of the family there’s so much diversity there on where people have come from. So in respect of knowing or feeling any different at that age, I wouldn’t say that I did. Until a point where I’d written an essay for school, I must have been 11 or 12 on – stereotypes and stereotypical situations. That was the point that my father started to explain some of the situations that he’d experienced as a child or experiences that his father had been through or my father had seen so, my granddad actually, I never met my granddad because he died when my father was a lot younger, when my dad was about 13 so all of this is just stories but there’s a certain age that things start to make sense and that was about, around about 11 or 12 whereby I got more of an understanding about the outside world and also our history or background to where we actually originated from.
JW: How important do you think that is to an understanding of your identity?
JB: I don’t think it affected me at a young age but when you get to the age of about 12 when you’ve got more understanding of about life then you can, you can then start appreciating other people’s point of view or shall we say empathy. So then you’ve got a much better understanding coming through junior school which I was of the age where I went to junior school and you realise that everybody does have different backgrounds and you can start to see how other people interact, other people’s way of life and especially because coming from a council estate where most of this council estates is new so all these people brought together. These council estates were built in the 1960’s so anybody moving onto these estates are all of a similar mindset or are, they’re coming at it from the same angle so by the time you’re in the 1970’s and you’ve got all these children that are growing up on these estates, nobody had any money, everybody seem to pull together.
There was a good community spirit and then from that you can see how life plays out and you can see because I went to Andrew Marvell Secondary School – we had a couple of Black pupils there. Obviously I could relate and understand and see in a different context to some of the other people or people in the same classes that had different views or had different backgrounds or weren’t aware of their backgrounds which does affect you as a child massively. It’s more having an understanding and being able to see things from other people’s point of view.
JW: Yeah, has it sparked any interest in any sort of cultural influences? Have you absorbed any cultural or West Indian influences?
JB: Yes, because when, that was actually the first time I went to the West Indies, the way of life, their attitude to life, the food, the family values which seem to be very strong and continued way past when you were a teenager I really do like. You can get to a point when that is, that is seen as something a little bit different to where most people go. So to have that understanding and then to get that hook of liking the Caribbean because after my first visit I must have been there 4 times now, to different islands.
And I do love the way of life and the way they have, work isn’t everything let me say. Work isn’t everything and coming from a family like I do that is quite creative and my father used to play the piano and my mum used to run a dance class so we always come up with this creativity and some of the carnivals that I’ve been to or Shirley Heights on a Sunday night or some of the beaches, just, just some of the things that are coming back to me now as I’m speaking. And even down to Shaky’s Pizza in Jamaica which is in Octoreus if I can remember rightly that for someone off a council estate is quite an eye-opener the first time you go there and then since then I’ve been with friends on a number of occasions. It just opens their eyes as well. We still talk about the holidays we had in Barbados now when we went to watch the cricket and it’s this is 20, 20 years later and it’s still the holiday we talk about in the pub when we meet at Christmas or whatever – to just reminisce about all times because it was fantastic.
JW: That West Indian attitude towards life. Have you absorbed that or was it innate within you? Are you a laid back sort of fella?
JB: No, to be quite honest, no. My sister and my father so laid back, totally different attitude to me but that is just the person that you are isn’t it. I can, I can relax when you get me to one of those beaches or one of those bars or one of those events or musical event but no. I have a different, a totally different approach to things like that than my sister for example and it’s something I can’t really fall into.
JW: I’ve got in my mind what might be quite a stereotypical image of people from the West Indies but I think of them as being very,very creative and fun loving. Would that be an accurate description of that national character?
JB: I think it would to a certain degree – but people are always going to find creativity in whatever sense that is whether that is in an art form, whether it is music. It’s just more opportunities need to be taken to have events or cultural experiences or get-togethers shall we say so instead of having a meal let’s have a get together on the beach as a massive family and let’s all bring a little bit each – so they’re the sort of things that I can see or that stand out to me that are a little bit different and just the enjoyment of life really and the fun side of life which I suppose goes with the territory really as in whether that is the outdoor sort of life or having to deal with hurricanes that hit you – that’ another thing that comes back to me now, how it can go from brilliant sunshine to there’s a tornado coming down the road, let’s get in and get out of the way.
JW: So what sort of influence does this background have on you now? Are there any great icons of the West Indies that you look up to and have they influenced you?
JB: Not in my sense at the moment. It was more about the experiences that I actually had there. But having said that, Garfield Sobers, cricketer, was a big inspiration to my father, I know that, who did, and went to the cricket and managed to get him a shirt signed by him, so- but no it’s more about the lifestyle and the enjoyment for life and the live music and the experiencing things and being able to get involved rather than someone I can say ‘iconic’ or…no…no.
JW: Tell me something about any cultural changes you’ve noticed in Hull over the years that you’ve been living here.
JB: Cultural changes: two years ago we actually went to Liverpool to a go-see, once we knew that we were getting City of Culture; dealing with different schools or colleges throughout the East Riding – I have seen, and North Lincolnshire. I have seen a change to other people’s perceptions about what we are doing in Hull. Again friends that have come back that had moved away to go to university and stayed where they’ve stayed, have come back and said “that marina looks amazing now,” and “I can’t believe the difference in Hull.” And to live here you don’t see it as much, until someone points it out. But then once they do, and you think: that Marina is starting to look better, and this may be four or five years ago. So from that point you start to think, yes we are gradually getting there.
My, or what I have seen of other people’s views on Hull and the City of Culture in the last two years, have changed phenomenally in the fact that people are more aware; they are a little bit more perceptive because Hull as a, Hull as a community or a breed, are a little bit - well we’ll wait and see what everybody else thinks first. So, there is a big change, and it has had to build up slowly, not in order to not frighten people, but the things I’ve seen in the last year and some of the meetings I’ve had and the discussions with the different areas and the different groups, and then some of them I think I’ve seen over the last two weeks; I’m talking to people that I really didn’t think would get involved with City of Culture. - It’s changed my mind, give me - much more confidence that the, the City of Culture will get to the people that, of Hull, that need to be able to see and experience and then be enlightened, gradually, by some of these events that I’ve seen in Liverpool and different places, delivered in a professional manner because that was my concern. And I think, as it is now, this is just the start to the City of Culture.
JW: Would you describe Hull as a culturally diverse city?
JB: Yes I would.
JW: You would?
JB: I would in the fact that, - looking back and - diversity comes from people bringing new knowledge from different areas, different parts of the world, and just looking at The Deep and the arrivals and departures and all of it, just brings back in one fell swoop just how diverse Hull is. And for the, was it 300,000 visitors, that was just there for people to see and understand - with very little words, in a visual format, just in the last 150 - 200 years how we have been not only a port but this diverse area that people have come to, or on their way to somewhere else, or they get here and they don’t go anywhere else, or even getting through to Liverpool and the port there. And so yes, I think it is very cultural or could be even more so in the future once we have a little bit more confidence in ourselves and that is the people of Hull and how we can portray ourselves to the outside world.
JW: Do you think it’s significant, or is there any significance in the fact that, say for the sort of last three decades - you know: we benefited from globalisation; trade across the globe has been easier; communication across the globe has been easier, then all of a sudden there seems to be sort of racial boundaries and cultural boundaries remerging - do you think that’s true? Is that evident in Hull?
JB: The world is getting smaller due to the internet and everything else. But immigration or, immigration is nothing new. How people react to it and the publicity it gets, how it’s sold in the media I think has changed. But immigration has always been there. And, this employing and distributing labour throughout the world has always gone on. And travel has got faster, communication has gone faster as you say, but how it is sold and the negativity that it picks up from people that think they wound benefit from giving that side of the story. People’s awareness and understanding, it’s knowledge isn’t it? It’s just coming back to the empathy again, and the understanding of people because when I look back at my grandparents on both sides of the family, then it’s evident that at some point that people either want to explore or have to travel to different places or, for all sorts of different reasons and I can see that.
Teaching, whether it be teaching in Scarborough, I’ve thought about this ten years ago, I was teaching in Scarborough but I was teaching a boy there who was Polish, and he was with his mother and then a year later, his father had come and he had started to do a course as well. So I can see connections there in how their family are either travelling to better themselves or for whatever reason. Everybody has different reasons, but to be able to understand or allow, or give them time to develop and pursue whatever, whatever it is and whatever reason that these people need time don’t they.
JW: You’re a very skilled designer and but you concentrate on teaching and inspiring young people too. Why have you taken that route?
JB: I took that route after - working for myself and also teaching part time. And it, there comes a point where the only way we really evolve is through sharing knowledge and once you realise that, if as a designer you can work with one client and that means one person benefits from either the knowledge or the expertise that you’ve got. You work with a class or a group, then all them people are sharing that information - all them people will go off into different avenues and use that information in different ways. But also, I get to learn as much as some of the pupils because it is a fast moving world, as we’ve said technology and everything, it is hard to keep up, especially as a teacher, with the marking and the preparation and everything else. So, it offers me the freedom to be able to not only communicate and share knowledge and ideas, but also learn from the pupils that I teach. So it is a two way process and that then becomes much more exciting, much more engaging, because when I look back, some of the teachers that I had at junior school that still influence me now. But it’s not until you think back and look at some of these situations and think, well there’s no reason why I can’t sort of go into that avenue and do it, not only for myself, and privately, but that gives me the flexibility to be able to deal with the pupils or students that would benefit most.
JW: Looking to the future - what are your hopes and dreams both for yourself and for the city of Hull.
JB: For myself, to with start with, for the future. Now, I always said, and this links back directly to why we are here today, that I would be quite happy to have a little strip of beach in Barbados and rent out half a dozen deck chairs so that I could experience all these things that I like about the Caribbean, but also to be able to share stories and information and just generally talk to people in a relaxed atmosphere and possibly get some of this laid back attitude that some of the other members of my family have. But as you grow up, you realise, that there’s other things that you’d like to pursue, not to say that I wouldn’t like to do that when I retire, but - for the future, to be able to narrow things down and get the teaching side together. I would like in ten years time to have a canal boat that could be used as a teaching pod which would then allow us to have a floating design studio, think back to all this travel and experience and the exciting side of life that I like, and that would enable me to do everything with the freedom and flexibility of what I’ve spent two years setting up now.
For the city of Hull and the City of Culture: had a conversation this morning with someone -who told me “that’ll all be done and finished by August.” I laughed, started explaining the Liverpool story, because I can only see it being the start of something on a much bigger scale that outside investors will want to get involved in, people will want to come to Hull, people will want to live in Hull. And from that, it will hopefully spark the, it will spark the people of Hull to go out and explore some of these areas that we seem to be a little bit frightened of at the moment because - the debate about The Blade now, is it art, is it now art, is it just engineering - I don’t think it really matters what people think it is, it is caused such debate - and viewpoints - which even in my house we can’t agree on it. So I think over the next five, seven years we will see even further development and promotion of the city and what we can achieve long term.
JW: So Jason I’ve known you quite a while, and I didn’t know that you had an African connection. It’s quite a surprise there.
JB: There is a surprise to a lot of people that I know. Yeah a lot of my friends - up to the age of, say 20, didn’t know that I had African roots. The ones that do know are still quite surprised. Some still don’t believe me. They’ll probably believe me now. But, having said that, there’s no reason they should know, unless we get to a conversation, where it comes up, where it comes up in conversation because as you can tell, it’s not a conversation you can take in two minutes. Someone ask me that, there’s a lot of questions that going to follow it, which then means we’re sat there, maybe an hour, we may be explaining things. And also the fact that I didn’t until the last few weeks, have great understanding what that heritage was, other than knowing that my Granddad was from Jamaica, he married my Grandma when he came to Hull about the 1930s.
Outside of that, I didn’t really know much more other than the fact that looking back now, that obviously was quite taboo at the time. Also the fact that they had twins and my dad was a lot lighter in colour with blue eyes than his sister. Now there’s another thing, that when he looked back, I would like to ask questions of, say my grandparent’s as to what they experienced, or how that, how that was. But in my own sense, there’s, I’ve been open with people, but It is hard to look at me, and think other than the fact that I’ve got the traditional curly hair from the Bowers family, again, that’s not as curly as my sister’s.
JW: Is it becoming increasingly important to you that people know of your heritage?
JB: I think there will be a lot more questions, now - and I’m quite happy to answer these questions, but it’s not really the sort of thing that usually comes up in conversation unless they are close friends, or because, why would somebody come up to you, and ask. But having said that, once people do, they are quite intrigued, in the fact that one side of, one side of the family I’ve got a granddad that’s from Jamaica, and I’ve got a grandma that’s from Hull, but yet on the other side of the family I’ve got a grandma whose parents were from Ireland and a granddad whose father was German who also came over in the war. So for someone to start asking me about my heritage, or, there’s all sorts there, that it’s not a two minute conversation. But also goes back to what we’ve said already about the diversity and, the = area of Hull and how it has this diverse culture and people obviously seem to have come here for, just my… In our generation as in all generations, there are so many people that if they hadn’t have come to Hull for whatever reason, means I wouldn’t be here today.
JW: Is it something you take more pride in as the years go by?
JB: Yes.
JW: Yes. Why?
JB: Because it makes me feel, it makes me feel that, not only am I a little bit different in the sense that I have got, like a lot of people, with mixed or, immigration or mixed cultures from different parts of the world, these things come together for some special reason that is outside of my control, won’t be repeated again and It’s the sort of things that money can’t buy. Until you start getting a little bit older, you start looking at these things and just weighing up just how much of life is really outside of your hands - when you like to think that you’re good on the planning side of things like myself, it is, yes , and I do feel quite proud and privileged to have parents from all different parts of the world.
JW: Are there any circumstances in which you would feel uncomfortable sharing this information?
JB: Not at all. Why, no, not at all, and why should I? Its, it’s part of me - there’s things there that = have obviously influenced the way I’ve been brought up in the past. There’s the fact that I was brought up on a council estate, so I, I’ve been christened at the local church, I’ve been to the primary school, and alongside of all that, that’s the side that people see, there’s all this diverse background that makes everyone in life who they are today.
JW: Are the West Indian influences in your, in your background, of more importance, of more importance than the German or Irish?
JB: - No. No, because when I look at it like that, these people I didn’t know, and it’s all information that I am told. I get much more understanding of possibly my heritage by visiting these places, so, although I like going to Jamaica or Antigua or Barbados, but in the same respect I can get a much better understanding of, maybe how my great grandparents were by, going to Germany and being in Berlin, and again, loving the fact of Berlin and the way that is, a totally different place to Jamaica, but again I feel quite comfortable in the cultural diversity and mixing , and the excitement, all the things that possibly my grandparents experienced, and that’s why they travelled or explored way back a hundred years ago. Do I think people’s perception of me will change? – Personally I’m not really bothered if it does or not. I think there’ll be a lot more questions. People will want to know more, about my background, or my grandparents’ back ground, on the either side from what we’ve just discussed. But - it also opens up a lot of opportunities for me to find out more about grandparents way back, and also, new questions that will be either asked of me, or I can ask of other people, because this has started, possibly , a whole new different avenue to how people will perceive me, expect me to act, or I don’t know, it might just, I really don’t know. It’s quite exciting though.
JW: If there’s one point you‘d want the listener to take away from what you’ve shared in the last half an hour, what would that be, what would your message be?
JB: - To book one extra day to however long you are coming to visit Hull, and when you think you’ve done everything that is on your list, or anybody else has told you to do, get on one of the local buses and out into some of the - council estates or, areas that people are developing, doing their own projects, doing exhibitions and promoting their side of Hull, and what Hull means to them. Not just the town centre and the history there, but some of these estates that have got their own communities and - don’t always get into the town centre, or the children don’t always get into the town centre, yet they’re doing their own exhibitions, projects relating to their side of Hull, how they see Hull, and how they’d like to promote it to the wider audience. And that would be, that would be the thing that I’d advise people to do. Get out and go see the further reaches of Hull and the surrounding areas.
JW: Jason, thank you very much
JB: Thank you.